Some Israelis are living in the land of their grandfathers but most of them have countries of origin they can be returned to. If that would be bad for them, there’s always countries they can emigrate to. But most solutions that aren’t zionist or “two state” are along the lines of “abolish the ethnostate and replace it with a real democracy” in which case the people currently living in Israel (minus those guilty of crimes against humanity) largely go about their lives as they did before.
So you don’t believe Jews used to inhabit Israel, despite the evidence? They do have a valid reason for making a claim to the land, which is entirely different from your example
When your ancestors lives in another continent for centuries you lose your connection and can’t have any claim or force a state on the local population . The ancestry argument is very stupid
No I believe that they were originally from that spot between Egypt and Israel until they moved to Egypt and then to Israel after they committed genocide and killing the people that lived there before them. Then they got booted out of Israel and lived other places. They have less claim to the land than the people that were there in the 1800s. Have you not read the Bible?
Given that answer, and that Palestinians don’t currently live in the bits of the region that Israel occupies (whether legally or illegally) it seems you understand that if you leave a place you don’t have an eternal right to move back there, but that nevertheless for some length of time you retain such a claim.
I think that’s the key to understanding why it can get a bit complicated…
It is only complicated because of after ww2 the allies decided to carve up land that they did not own and did not ask the people who lived there where boarders should be. They also kicked out those that lived in Palestine and gave it to people who had not lived there in over 400 years. When outsiders who don’t live in an area make decisions for those that do shit goes wrong.
People say this all the time but this is not the reason it’s complicated. There were already hundreds of thousands of Jews living in the region by that point - Zionist migration to Palestine started in the 19th century, and that had been the cause of tensions for decades already. Hundreds of thousands more wanted to leave the Europe that had just tried to murder them again. If the Allies had just decided to bugger off and leave them to it the result would have been far from peaceful. As it was, they tried to achieve a compromise through the UN. They failed at that task but not because they “decided to carve up land.” Britain in particular refused to implement the partition plan recommended by the UN special committee because it was not acceptable to the Arabs.
In 1947 jews made up 32% of the population in Palestine 630,000 out of 1,970,000. In 1948 jews made up 82% 716,700 out of 872,700. Somebody must have moved over a million people out of Palestine to make Israel. Forcibly removing people that had lived there since it was owned by the Ottoman Empire would make them angry and wanting their land back.
Zionism among jews who never left Palestine was not popular, Israel couldn’t exists with only the local jews alone. European jews who lost the connection to the land had are the reason why Israel was created and had zero right to the land
This isn’t ancient history, this is so within our memorable lifetime. Palestinians were slaughtered and forced out within living memory and a lot of them are still alive and have the keys to they’re stolen homes.
Jacob from New York does not have the same claim to the land his ancestors occupied thousands of years ago, as the Palestinian who built the literal house he stole after living on the land occupied by her ancestors for all recorded history.
Yes, but I think that supports restarting from the 1940s, not from the 1700s. By 1947 there were hundreds of thousands of Jews living in the territory that now forms Israel and Palestine.
We want a one state solution because thanks to Israel fault of building illegal settlements a two state solution is no longer possible . Nobody advocate for kicking out all Israeli from the land
A two state solution is still possible. Israel kicked all the settlers out of Gaza once, and it can be done with other settlements too. It’s only infeasible because no country that matters is willing to stand up to Netanyahu in a way that matters. But without doing that, there’s also no way to enact whatever counter-genocide it is you’re advocating.
There was only 9000 settlers in Gaza. Here we are talking about 700k . Israel will probably do the same with Arabs and will be transferred to the new state which will be in a such economical weakness .
counter-genocide it is you’re advocating.
I said i advocate for a white state solution with equal rights so nobody is going to be genocide or ethnically cleansing stop being disingenuous
Israel should not be coming back, it needs to be replaced by a country representing the indigenous land owners and not European colonisers.
What happens to the people living in Israel currently?
Some Israelis are living in the land of their grandfathers but most of them have countries of origin they can be returned to. If that would be bad for them, there’s always countries they can emigrate to. But most solutions that aren’t zionist or “two state” are along the lines of “abolish the ethnostate and replace it with a real democracy” in which case the people currently living in Israel (minus those guilty of crimes against humanity) largely go about their lives as they did before.
Reminds me of how they’re sending people packing in the US. At what point are you allowed to stay on the land
Jews believe they are the indigenous land owners. That’s what this whole thing is about.
Yes and POTUS believes that Tylenol causes Autism. Just because leaders believe something doesn’t make it true.
So you don’t believe Jews used to inhabit Israel, despite the evidence? They do have a valid reason for making a claim to the land, which is entirely different from your example
When your ancestors lives in another continent for centuries you lose your connection and can’t have any claim or force a state on the local population . The ancestry argument is very stupid
No I believe that they were originally from that spot between Egypt and Israel until they moved to Egypt and then to Israel after they committed genocide and killing the people that lived there before them. Then they got booted out of Israel and lived other places. They have less claim to the land than the people that were there in the 1800s. Have you not read the Bible?
Given that answer, and that Palestinians don’t currently live in the bits of the region that Israel occupies (whether legally or illegally) it seems you understand that if you leave a place you don’t have an eternal right to move back there, but that nevertheless for some length of time you retain such a claim.
I think that’s the key to understanding why it can get a bit complicated…
It is only complicated because of after ww2 the allies decided to carve up land that they did not own and did not ask the people who lived there where boarders should be. They also kicked out those that lived in Palestine and gave it to people who had not lived there in over 400 years. When outsiders who don’t live in an area make decisions for those that do shit goes wrong.
People say this all the time but this is not the reason it’s complicated. There were already hundreds of thousands of Jews living in the region by that point - Zionist migration to Palestine started in the 19th century, and that had been the cause of tensions for decades already. Hundreds of thousands more wanted to leave the Europe that had just tried to murder them again. If the Allies had just decided to bugger off and leave them to it the result would have been far from peaceful. As it was, they tried to achieve a compromise through the UN. They failed at that task but not because they “decided to carve up land.” Britain in particular refused to implement the partition plan recommended by the UN special committee because it was not acceptable to the Arabs.
In 1947 jews made up 32% of the population in Palestine 630,000 out of 1,970,000. In 1948 jews made up 82% 716,700 out of 872,700. Somebody must have moved over a million people out of Palestine to make Israel. Forcibly removing people that had lived there since it was owned by the Ottoman Empire would make them angry and wanting their land back.
Zionism among jews who never left Palestine was not popular, Israel couldn’t exists with only the local jews alone. European jews who lost the connection to the land had are the reason why Israel was created and had zero right to the land
This isn’t ancient history, this is so within our memorable lifetime. Palestinians were slaughtered and forced out within living memory and a lot of them are still alive and have the keys to they’re stolen homes.
Jacob from New York does not have the same claim to the land his ancestors occupied thousands of years ago, as the Palestinian who built the literal house he stole after living on the land occupied by her ancestors for all recorded history.
It’s not complicated at all.
You left out the part when Israelis continuing forcing Palestinians off their land to this day.
It’s a bit different when you’re forcibly removed from your home, no?
Yes, but I think that supports restarting from the 1940s, not from the 1700s. By 1947 there were hundreds of thousands of Jews living in the territory that now forms Israel and Palestine.
They were moved there by European colonialists who didn’t give a shit about the natives who already lived there.
Jewish people have more current claim to Brooklyn than they do to the land that corresponds to ancient Israel and Judea.
Sounds like you want revenge colonialism.
It’s nice to see that you and Israel can agree on the desirability of a forever war and ethnic cleansing…
We want a one state solution because thanks to Israel fault of building illegal settlements a two state solution is no longer possible . Nobody advocate for kicking out all Israeli from the land
A two state solution is still possible. Israel kicked all the settlers out of Gaza once, and it can be done with other settlements too. It’s only infeasible because no country that matters is willing to stand up to Netanyahu in a way that matters. But without doing that, there’s also no way to enact whatever counter-genocide it is you’re advocating.
There was only 9000 settlers in Gaza. Here we are talking about 700k . Israel will probably do the same with Arabs and will be transferred to the new state which will be in a such economical weakness .
I said i advocate for a white state solution with equal rights so nobody is going to be genocide or ethnically cleansing stop being disingenuous